Guy923

And here we are back to square one. Just because they overlook racism and sexism, and keep company with racists and sexists, and have been praised by other racists and sexists, doesn't make them racist or sexist.
 
He's racist.
 
"You have an individual, Mr Bannon, who’s basically creating the ideological aspects of where we’re going." - The former Imperial Wizard of the KKK.
 
It's really not that hard.

Regardless I don't think anyone who's penned articles like these should be given a fuckin' chance

Regardless I don't think anyone who's penned articles like these should be given a fuckin' chance

you know what, you're right. im going to give trump a chance. maybe he is not the racist sexist idiot hes been claiming to be for the entire election. maybe hes a reasonable guy, that would in no way hire a white supremacist as his chief strategist
 
 
oh...

huff feeling like lester holt at a debate rn

It doesn't count if it's white people oppressing others, since we're the natural rulers of the world. 

You've contradicted yourself.
 
Apartheid was a system put in place by the Dutch in South Africa. It wasn't a system of separation, it was objectively a system of oppression.
 
The Dutch were immigrants.
 
If you genuinely believe that Apartheid was a good thing, then by proxy you are saying that immigrants coming into a country and oppressing the native population through the enforcement of their own beliefs is a good thing.
 
So I guess you would be cool with immigrants coming in and implementing Sharia Law, correct?
 
But nah man, keep on posting your funny 4chan frog meme man!

That would be a snuff film

The assumption that our concept of racism by definition is hating everyone and wanting to "give those fucking niggers their due" is also in some respects a straw man argument. You can be racist without having to be some kind of genocidal clan member caricature because systematic racism manifests itself in a multitude of extremely subtle ways and it's easy to buy into it in ways we don't even think about.
 
For instance, telling a black person they're well spoken because you assumed they wouldn't be
 
or making assumptions about the character of Mexican immigrants that you might not make about the character of European immigrants
 
or like, wholeheartedly believing you're in some kind of protracted race war taking place on a global scale in which everyone who isn't part of your ethnic is coming to destroy your way of life

congratulations. you've lost the argument. you've already embarrassed yourself pitifully, but honestly, just walk away.
 
for what it's worth, a very brief summation of why your most dear beliefs are wrong on an axiomatic level:
 
there are nation-states for white ethnic groups. in fact, there's an entire continent you can fuck up like that if you so please. it's called europe. your race does not have the exclusive and sole right to authority over the world's third largest nation, especially not one that was taken only within the last four centuries or so by brutal genocide and conquest. every american citizen has the right to have their interests served by the state and white nationalism fails to account for that. if blacks, mexicans and other ethnic minorities are your enemies, then congratulations, you are literally a white supremacist. it really is that simple.

well hes not wrong.

Well, we truly are a diverse bunch, we now have an open white supremacist as part of our group.
Yay for us.

There's nothing further to discuss, your entire stance is based entirely off of bigotry, bullshit, and "I've got mine".
You don't actually counter with actual arguments, just "libs this" "libs that", and any time you do attempt to argue, it's the same old tired bullshit again and again.

So that's all this is about, keeping white people in power.
At least you finally just came out and said it.

let me go through this post inane point by inane point.
 
1. I explained why the original purpose of the electoral college was to keep people like you from voting. that's ostensibly a good thing. I also explained why the product of the electoral college in its current state is extremely unfortunate. but that bit is obvious if you're not incredibly ignorant.
 
2. your response was "democracy is not important, what's important is that I get my way". you literally just quoted my entire post without actually so much as attempting to rebutt anything that I said.
 
3. you are the only one not arguing. you're just vomiting garbage onto your keyboard with the smug self-righteousness that only comes from conservatism: ie, "I'm right because that's the status quo"
 
4. there is no mask here. I legitimately and unashamedly believe that you should be disenfranchised, as did our founding fathers. you are cancerous to democracy.
 
5. liberalism is not a left-wing ideology. literally all of the founding fathers were classical liberals, as am I. go google the word "liberal", come back and explain to me how it has anything to do with the political left.
 
6. you still haven't once explained how even genuine left wing ideologies are in any way bad for society or how a victory for the political left would not have objectively been the best outcome of this election. 
 
your incredulity comes not from any genuine fault of argumentation but from your own ignorance. I have made many clearly structured arguments thus far but your response is to laugh from your failure to understand them. I suppose that's not out of character for you. the bit about parties is a strawman, but the democratic party objectively does come closer to serving the interests of the american people than the republican party, and if you don't believe that, congratulations, you're willfully ignorant. and if you think voting a republican into the white house -- a republican who is going to appoint top republican sycophants to be the heads of various essential federal agencies -- somehow served to kill the republican establishment, well, I don't think I can really address that without copping an easy infraction.
 
if we can make it through the next four years without your party completely destroying our planet, our nation and our democracy, then you're going to have a very, very miserable life in about twenty years. and I'm looking forward to it.
 
edit: john caveson, please take your reputation away from me you petulant child. you truly haven't the slightest bit what us adults are talking about here and I wish not for my own actions to enable you any bit of validation.

There's a reason conservatives are a dying group.
Even with a Democratic presidency, you wouldn't have been "disarmed", you really think that We The People™ would simply let the 2nd Amendment go like that?
And, excuse me? "Genocidal freaks"? What the fuck are you even talking about? "Importing voters", that's not how this works.

And thanks to you, we're not going to "keep" our climate change, trans bathroom rights, or a bunch of other things.
Trump's cabinet appointments are all known anti-LGBTQ people, he's going to overturn pretty much every Executive Order that Obama gave, especially the ones protecting trans people. His Justices are going to overturn same-sex marriage as soon as a case gets accepted to the Supreme Court challenging it. He's got a climate-change denier as the head of the fucking Environmental Protection Agency, an absolute moron who could be Secretary of Education or Secretary of Health and Human Services, and the list goes on!
So, from the bottom of my heart, in the deepest pits of hell itself, Thank you for fucking over half this country based on absolute bullshit.

this is pathetic. you are an embarrassment to your country and even your party. when did I imply anything about genocide? what aspect of liberalism supports genocide? what form of genocide specifically targets fascists? but yes, rest assured, I'm armed and your man crush isn't going to change that. with that said, someone in this thread actually is advocating for violence to achieve a political end:
 
 
furthermore, you seem to think that this election is some kind of war, except you're literally at war with a majority of the american people:
it's embarrassing enough that you think donald trump actually represents your own interest. "you" might have "won" but I can assure you, everybody lost. that includes you. and you're going to keep losing, in life, in elections, and in internet arguments if you come at me swinging with the ideological might of an elementary school student. 

a pathetic argument from a pitiful ideological basis. congratulations, discontent with present circumstances and pervasive ignorance were able to mobilize enough of your delusional brethren to in a day set our country back years. but no matter, the tide of social progress is unstoppable. you'd better pray that trump declares martial law and cancels the next election, because your comrades are dying off by the day, and soon enough, when unemployment skyrockets under a homogeneously republican administration, cletus and mabel aren't going to be on your side anymore. 
 
you, as do your allies in congress and your despicable president-elect, display open and unashamed contempt for democracy. but I've got some bad news for you: after four years of trump, you're still going to be unhappy, you're still going to be unsuccessful, and you're still going to externalize all of your problems onto vulnerable demographic groups. four more years of regress beyond that won't change reality either. you are on the wrong side of history and you will be dragged kicking and screaming into the twenty-first century. 
 
of course, it is entirely possible that you are happy and successful -- I'm sure some republicans are -- but then why would one support the GOP? I suppose the answer to that lies in willful ignorance and gross delusion -- perhaps a more shameful alternative. no matter. although it is not without oscillation, progress comes and it won't be stopped. and although you may not have it that it would come through democracy, worry not -- it will come. 
 
of course, when that happens, if you don't want to live in a liberal democracy, there are still conservative strongholds on the planet that won't change any time soon. saudi arabia, russia, cuba, just to name a few. I think you'll like it there. 

you legitimately just need to stop talking. is that what you really think destroys a democracy? hitler was democratically elected. did germany devolve into nazism because of sore losers? 
 
and you better believe I'm exercising my second amendment right. donald trump has open contempt for democracy and private firearm ownership is one of the most important democratic institutions. he's advocated for disarming suspected criminals before with no trial or investigation. 
do you really think this is what's happening? that there are offices just filled with democrats around the country where they say "okay, we've been doing great importing these immigrants but I think we should aim for 10% growth this year"
 
the only people who can vote in our elections are united states citizens. if you aren't getting the most votes from united states citizens, tough fucking luck. if people aren't keen on your shit economic policy and fascist immigration plans, that's not a fault of democracy.
 
I'd just like to go ahead and point out that the electoral college was literally designed to stop donald trump from happening. in its original iteration, it would have done so. it had nothing to do with the balance of power between states and urban or rural areas -- that's what the senate is for, and each state gets an elector for each senator. but the winner-take-all system is a recent development and has to do strictly with game theory involving the two dominant parties. the winner-take-all system assures that while neither of them can win every election, third parties and unaffiliated candidates will never gain the slightest bit of traction.
 
here are some facts about the electoral college:
1. under the original plan, states weren't supposed to hold elections for president. they simply selected their electors (by the means of their choosing) and the electors voted independently of each other and independently of the electorate
 
2. under the original plan, donald trump never would have happened, because in general, any federal public official is presumed to be more educated and more intelligent than the average voter. and while they may not necessarily be more fit to choose the president than every single voter, they're doubtlessly more fit to choose him than trump voters. because electors were not allowed to hold public office and because they were so few in number, they were considered to be largely above the pathetic tactics that are used to win the presidency today: demagoguery, corruption, pandering, ignorance, etc. alexander hamilton:


 
3. let's be very clear: the electoral college was designed to disenfranchise voters. because while universal suffrage may be important to a democracy, direct election of the president is not. under the original plan, the electors could never disobey the popular vote because there was no popular vote. but today, remnants of the original plan still exist, such as faithless electors. I just want trump supporters to remember that when the electoral college convenes, most electors there have the legal option to cast their ballots for clinton, johnson, stein, etc. regardless of who their state voted for, and I'd argue that they even have something of an obligation to do so.
 
4. under the original plan, it was considered to be improbable that any candidate would sweep the electoral college majority more than perhaps once every few elections. and if a candidate managed to do so, they were considered to be the clear choice for president. this was because the electoral college itself was intended to be a check on parties (again, the electors themselves did not have any affiliation, nor any supposed obligation to vote in a specific way -- this was before the two parties managed to consolidate power in just about every state in the union). thus, there would generally be five or so people in reasonable contention for the presidency. even a candidate markedly more popular than the rest would only get, say, 40%, and the election would be decided by the house of representatives. this was considered to be a desirable outcome, given that representatives are, like electors, generally more intelligent and educated than trump voters, and they are both directly elected and directly representative of the country's population distribution. 
 
again, there are no laws on a federal level that actually require states to cast their ballots on a winner-take-all basis. it's a completely inane idea that more or less accounts to gerrymandering (albeit from a bottom-up perspective rather than top-down) and it inarguably accomplishes the exact same effect. in this election, over half of all ballots cast literally did not matter -- that is to say, three million people in california could have stayed home and no matter what the other states decided, it could not have possibly changed the election. four million people in texas could have stayed home and no matter what the other states decided, it could not have possibly changed the election. that is not democracy. the electoral college in its current state is an abomination; it was neutered when it should have been killed. it can no longer achieve its original purpose and functions now to simply consolidate power into the hands of the two major parties. if you defend it, do so only knowing that it was designed to keep you from voting, and reasonably so. 

If we have to keep the Electoral College, that's at least a better way of having it operate, the "winner take all" for Electoral Votes is utter bullshit.
However I still think it's an out-dated system that just needs to be retired.

And the Voter Rights Act being overturned didn't help anything to deal with the low voter turnout.
Because it was overturned, there were over 800 fewer polling places across the nation, and some states enacted stricter restrictions, which resulted in hundreds of thousands of people in Wisconsin alone being unable to vote. Who knows just how many people were either turned away or discouraged from voting because of these newer restrictions.

it wasn't subSPUF without me so we're already off to a good start
 
if you must argue about something else, then might I offer a gentle reminder that SPUFdark is by a massive margin still the best theme? SPUFblue comes in a distant second and SPUFlight is more or less the theme equivalent of voting for donald trump

The last thing I'll say is, well yeah. Maybe for you. But I guarantee you there are people who have already lost their lives indirectly just because of this guy becoming president. Hate crimes went up by 80% when Brexit happened. It'll be worse here.
 
Already read about 3 shootouts in the last 2 days, one half an hour from where I live. People are dying and will die as a result of a racist president emboldening the other racists in the country. They have their initiative and people will suffer. But it's okay, because life'll go on for you I guess. It's not the end of the world for you maybe, but a lot of LGBT people, and minorities in general are terrified out of their fucking minds.
 
The only reason I'm not afraid to leave my own god damn house is because I live in an extremely Hispanic dense area. If I were in any bible belt state I would not step out of my god damn house out of fear. So there you go. We'll keep moving forward, but at what cost. There is no world where people should have to fear for their lives because a presidential candidate has been elected.
 
Also I'm just gonna go ahead and also mention Mike Pence is a human being who probably shouldn't exist. That's all I got.

The last thing I'll say is, well yeah. Maybe for you. But I guarantee you there are people who have already lost their lives indirectly just because of this guy becoming president. Hate crimes went up by 80% when Brexit happened. It'll be worse here.
 
Already read about 3 shootouts in the last 2 days, one half an hour from where I live. People are dying and will die as a result of a racist president emboldening the other racists in the country. They have their initiative and people will suffer. But it's okay, because life'll go on for you I guess. It's not the end of the world for you maybe, but a lot of LGBT people, and minorities in general are terrified out of their fucking minds.
 
The only reason I'm not afraid to leave my own god damn house is because I live in an extremely Hispanic dense area. If I were in any bible belt state I would not step out of my god damn house out of fear. So there you go. We'll keep moving forward, but at what cost. There is no world where people should have to fear for their lives because a presidential candidate has been elected.
 
Also I'm just gonna go ahead and also mention Mike Pence is a human being who probably shouldn't exist. That's all I got.