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The assumption that our concept of racism by definition is hating everyone and wanting to "give those fucking niggers their due" is also in some respects a straw man argument. You can be racist without having to be some kind of genocidal clan member caricature because systematic racism manifests itself in a multitude of extremely subtle ways and it's easy to buy into it in ways we don't even think about. For instance, telling a black person they're well spoken because you assumed they wouldn't be or making assumptions about the character of Mexican immigrants that you might not make about the character of European immigrants or like, wholeheartedly believing you're in some kind of protracted race war taking place on a global scale in which everyone who isn't part of your ethnic is coming to destroy your way of life

That would be a snuff film

This isn't a game of Civ, life is not a "competition", yet somehow, we've managed to turn it into one. "Nation-states" aren't going to work. We can see it now, the UK is scrambling to pick itself back up after Brexit, Israel and Pakistan have been in an uneasy state for quite some time, and it's highly obvious that our "nation of states" is starting to come apart at the seams. Quite frankly, it's high time to federalize the entire nation, no more "United States of America", just "America". You say that domestic politics is ugly, but politics between two different nations is far uglier. "Acting with prudence" is not the promotion of one group over all others, acting with true prudence would be breaking down the barriers we've put between ourselves, stop thinking in terms of "blacks" and "whites", and cooperate as people. Instead, you only want to put up physical, geographical, and legal barriers, but also reinforce cultural ones. You still voted for him. Regardless, you're set in your willful ignorance, and I'd likely be making greater use of my time by bashing my head into a wall repeatedly. Your ideology has caused immense harm to many people, and will continue to do so until the movement itself dies out. Be on the wrong side of history if you want, I'm tired of this "debate".

Life is of course a competition, resources are limited. Land is limited. Humans are naturally greedy. Add these things up. You get competition, every time. Nation-states aren't perfect, but they are the best we've got. What other model of government would you prefer? Empires never last forever. One world governments would just make all wars civil wars. I think federalizing the nation won't work, we'll just end up with Articles of Confederation-tier bullshit, although letting certain parts of the country secede may be for the best, though. No group would be promoted in the policies I've put forth (moratorium, deportation, official English). They would boost assimilation and hopefully help ease tensions. The "movement" will never, ever die out, because it's not an ideology like fascism or communism. You will never get people to not think about race, ancestry, ethnicity. It is literally never going to happen because us humans are hard-wired this way. Well, I shouldn't say never, maybe they'll find a way to breed it out of us using space-age tech. You want a utopia. You will never have one, and you will destroy countless nations trying to create one. The races will never get together and sing kumbayah. No argument, no substance, just pure snark.

"haha I just called "human rights" a buzzword, man im so smart. i really dont understand why every minority disagrees with my superior world view." -raison, getting his swastika tattoo.

Well, I'd like to challenge that. There's a difference between your first and second example. In the first one, you're talking to one man. Judging one man by his race is an infinitely stupid idea because you can get to know him, and any personal qualities he has will far outweigh his race. But you should of course be able to make assumptions about large groups in the tens of millions when it comes to immigration, it's a public policy like any other. If that's racism then the charge is so stupidly applied as to be useless. As for your last, of course Mexicans or Asians or whatever aren't consciously trying to destroy my way of life (well, usually). But people are people. They prefer their own customs and their own culture, it's only natural. When we have mass immigration we can't really expect them to integrate to a culture they see as inferior, when they can instead be fully immersed in their own culture. And then before you know it whoops looks like a quarter of the country doesn't speak the same language as the other three-quarters (we're at about 10% now). Say goodbye to your nation, say hello to the empire. Again, the ONLY policies I recommend that could fix this is an immigration moratorium, deportation of illegals, and English as an official language, with free classes offered for those who need it. Maybe some more national holidays. Every person would be equal under the law, straight white male or transgender black female. These would probably create a good deal of unity and save us from the brink. A lotta buzzwords and no substance. Besides, I'm in California. Not really my fault he got elected is it?

what am i getting wrong? it doesnt matter whatever bullshit reason you try to come up with to justify your vote for trump. the fact is that you knowingly voted for a bigot and helped put people who have openly expressed their hatred for everyone who isn't a straight white male into some of the most powerful positions in the country. because of your vote, you helped create a system that does not give a shit about the future of the world, the human rights of every minority, and the freedom for those people to express their thoughts and desires. all because you dont like white people not being in power, whatever that means. its that simple. you can whine about me creating a strawman all you'd like, it doesnt change the fact that youre an idiot. this is the correct and right way to think. too bad not everyone agrees with that.

Well this has been an interesting discussion...I really hope raison's trolling there because goddamn, dude. Also, slight comment on the "we're gonna become Brazil" comment you made there-isn't the current government pretty conservative? Because I'm pretty sure they recently impeached the left-leaning president and replaced her with a really conservative government. So wouldn't you WANT the US to be more like Brazil at this point? Anyways, it seems like a lot of Democrats, including Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, and my boy Chuck Schumer, are really rallying for Keith Ellison for the new head of the DNC. I never had heard of him, but he seems pretty legit to be honest-I think he would be a good candidate to try and pull the Democrats further left of center, which is where you could argue they're at right now. Plus, he's a black muslim, which I'm sure will endear him to people like...well, I guess people like our buddy Raison.

"yeah fuck climate change, basic human rights, freedom of speech! just so long as we whites stay in power and i can freely jerk off without some mexican watching me through the window." -raison, after voting

i think you dropped this raison:

congratulations. you've lost the argument. you've already embarrassed yourself pitifully, but honestly, just walk away. for what it's worth, a very brief summation of why your most dear beliefs are wrong on an axiomatic level: there are nation-states for white ethnic groups. in fact, there's an entire continent you can fuck up like that if you so please. it's called europe. your race does not have the exclusive and sole right to authority over the world's third largest nation, especially not one that was taken only within the last four centuries or so by brutal genocide and conquest. every american citizen has the right to have their interests served by the state and white nationalism fails to account for that. if blacks, mexicans and other ethnic minorities are your enemies, then congratulations, you are literally a white supremacist. it really is that simple.

well hes not wrong.

Well, we truly are a diverse bunch, we now have an open white supremacist as part of our group. Yay for us. There's nothing further to discuss, your entire stance is based entirely off of bigotry, bullshit, and "I've got mine". You don't actually counter with actual arguments, just "libs this" "libs that", and any time you do attempt to argue, it's the same old tired bullshit again and again.

So that's all this is about, keeping white people in power. At least you finally just came out and said it.

let me go through this post inane point by inane point. 1. I explained why the original purpose of the electoral college was to keep people like you from voting. that's ostensibly a good thing. I also explained why the product of the electoral college in its current state is extremely unfortunate. but that bit is obvious if you're not incredibly ignorant. 2. your response was "democracy is not important, what's important is that I get my way". you literally just quoted my entire post without actually so much as attempting to rebutt anything that I said. 3. you are the only one not arguing. you're just vomiting garbage onto your keyboard with the smug self-righteousness that only comes from conservatism: ie, "I'm right because that's the status quo" 4. there is no mask here. I legitimately and unashamedly believe that you should be disenfranchised, as did our founding fathers. you are cancerous to democracy. 5. liberalism is not a left-wing ideology. literally all of the founding fathers were classical liberals, as am I. go google the word "liberal", come back and explain to me how it has anything to do with the political left. 6. you still haven't once explained how even genuine left wing ideologies are in any way bad for society or how a victory for the political left would not have objectively been the best outcome of this election. your incredulity comes not from any genuine fault of argumentation but from your own ignorance. I have made many clearly structured arguments thus far but your response is to laugh from your failure to understand them. I suppose that's not out of character for you. the bit about parties is a strawman, but the democratic party objectively does come closer to serving the interests of the american people than the republican party, and if you don't believe that, congratulations, you're willfully ignorant. and if you think voting a republican into the white house -- a republican who is going to appoint top republican sycophants to be the heads of various essential federal agencies -- somehow served to kill the republican establishment, well, I don't think I can really address that without copping an easy infraction. if we can make it through the next four years without your party completely destroying our planet, our nation and our democracy, then you're going to have a very, very miserable life in about twenty years. and I'm looking forward to it. edit: john caveson, please take your reputation away from me you petulant child. you truly haven't the slightest bit what us adults are talking about here and I wish not for my own actions to enable you any bit of validation.

Trump won white Millennials by, I think 5 points? Hardly old.

There's a reason conservatives are a dying group. Even with a Democratic presidency, you wouldn't have been "disarmed", you really think that We The People™ would simply let the 2nd Amendment go like that? And, excuse me? "Genocidal freaks"? What the fuck are you even talking about? "Importing voters", that's not how this works. And thanks to you, we're not going to "keep" our climate change, trans bathroom rights, or a bunch of other things. Trump's cabinet appointments are all known anti-LGBTQ people, he's going to overturn pretty much every Executive Order that Obama gave, especially the ones protecting trans people. His Justices are going to overturn same-sex marriage as soon as a case gets accepted to the Supreme Court challenging it. He's got a climate-change denier as the head of the fucking Environmental Protection Agency, an absolute moron who could be Secretary of Education or Secretary of Health and Human Services, and the list goes on! So, from the bottom of my heart, in the deepest pits of hell itself, Thank you for fucking over half this country based on absolute bullshit.

this is pathetic. you are an embarrassment to your country and even your party. when did I imply anything about genocide? what aspect of liberalism supports genocide? what form of genocide specifically targets fascists? but yes, rest assured, I'm armed and your man crush isn't going to change that. with that said, someone in this thread actually is advocating for violence to achieve a political end: furthermore, you seem to think that this election is some kind of war, except you're literally at war with a majority of the american people: it's embarrassing enough that you think donald trump actually represents your own interest. "you" might have "won" but I can assure you, everybody lost. that includes you. and you're going to keep losing, in life, in elections, and in internet arguments if you come at me swinging with the ideological might of an elementary school student.

a pathetic argument from a pitiful ideological basis. congratulations, discontent with present circumstances and pervasive ignorance were able to mobilize enough of your delusional brethren to in a day set our country back years. but no matter, the tide of social progress is unstoppable. you'd better pray that trump declares martial law and cancels the next election, because your comrades are dying off by the day, and soon enough, when unemployment skyrockets under a homogeneously republican administration, cletus and mabel aren't going to be on your side anymore. you, as do your allies in congress and your despicable president-elect, display open and unashamed contempt for democracy. but I've got some bad news for you: after four years of trump, you're still going to be unhappy, you're still going to be unsuccessful, and you're still going to externalize all of your problems onto vulnerable demographic groups. four more years of regress beyond that won't change reality either. you are on the wrong side of history and you will be dragged kicking and screaming into the twenty-first century. of course, it is entirely possible that you are happy and successful -- I'm sure some republicans are -- but then why would one support the GOP? I suppose the answer to that lies in willful ignorance and gross delusion -- perhaps a more shameful alternative. no matter. although it is not without oscillation, progress comes and it won't be stopped. and although you may not have it that it would come through democracy, worry not -- it will come. of course, when that happens, if you don't want to live in a liberal democracy, there are still conservative strongholds on the planet that won't change any time soon. saudi arabia, russia, cuba, just to name a few. I think you'll like it there.

you're goddamn right http://i.imgur.com/XlNM9Lz.png